302 problem

[Gamer]

Is it possible for me to ask a help question here ?:confused:

[UGOTTBIT]

Is it possible for me to ask a help question here ?:confused:

What kind of problem are you having? Or call me @ 919-524-1402.

Rusty

[Gamer]

Well about a week ago iwent to the store and put gas in my 83 stang, on the way back not hot roding it starts kicking and backfiring, i finaly get it home and i change cap botton cion (msd) , new msb 6422 6al and then had to put on a used electronic ignition amplifier to get it to fire, now all it will do is skip and it is blowing back real bad, i am thinking just by chance 2 thing happened at one time, amplifier went bad or msd and caused electricle problem, but i am thinking hole in piston broke rocker arms or spring broke, sounds like it is runnind on 4 maybe 5 cylinders, driver side headers meade 500 to 600+ deg and passenger side about 355 to 350 deg. thats what happened, this is not a stock motor, it has a create cobra 302 all forged 8 to 10 psi Vortech trick flow twisted wedge heads,
and more.

[CWD]

Timing chain?

[UGOTTBIT]

It almost sounds like you broke a valve spring or two. As far as the MSD products I had a 6AL box too, but it only lasted 7 months, ever since then I bought a Pertronix box and it works like a charm. As far as it running hot on the drivers side it could be a lean condition and or a timing issue as well.

Rusty

[Gamer]

Timing chain did not enter my mind but i did turn the distributor some both ways and i could tell it changed, also before i changed all the electronics the tach was bouncing around, after i changed all that the tach was stable at first and after about 3 min of running it started bouncing again

[Gamer]

It almost sounds like you broke a valve spring or two. As far as the MSD products I had a 6AL box too, but it only lasted 7 months, ever since then I bought a Pertronix box and it works like a charm. As far as it running hot on the drivers side it could be a lean condition and or a timing issue as well.

Rusty

my next step was going to pull the upper intake so i can get to the valve covers and take them off and see what i can see.:(

[CWD]

Does sound like a timing chain from what you have said. I've seen similar results before.

[Gamer]

Does sound like a timing chain from what you have said. I've seen similar results before.
i dont think jumping time would cause my tach to flop around , holding gas at steady idle about 3000 rpm it jumps around from 2000 to 5000
i will not ruls out the chain, but do you think if it was the chain my timing would be off by using a timing light ? i would think so and i will test that.
what do you think ?

[Gamer]

Oh and bringing up the tach be so eratic it is not connected directly the msd it is wired as factory and msd stuff added, could the computor cause any thing like this, im thinking maybe but i dont think (think ) that the computor would cause the blow back.
or could it change the fire some how?

[rodcobra]

Check the ground on your MSD and a bad will do some bad running ,but not that bad and a broke rocker or something like it will do it too . Also check all your grounds to your tach ,MSD ,ect . :)

[UGOTTBIT]

I def think that from what you have described, you deff have an electrical problem either in the MSD parts or a possible tune in the ECM problem. I'm really thinking now that you deff need to re-wire the tach to the MSD to make it much simpler and that will eliminate the being the possible problem for one. I would start by unhooking all of the MSD parts and returing it back to stock electrical compontes and see if it runs and idles fine, if it does the MSD 6AL is bad, this happend to me about 9 months ago.

Rusty

[Gamer]

I def think that from what you have described, you deff have an electrical problem either in the MSD parts or a possible tune in the ECM problem. I'm really thinking now that you deff need to re-wire the tach to the MSD to make it much simpler and that will eliminate the being the possible problem for one. I would start by unhooking all of the MSD parts and returing it back to stock electrical compontes and see if it runs and idles fine, if it does the MSD 6AL is bad, this happend to me about 9 months ago.

Rusty
the msd was in the car when i bought it almost 5 years ago just to add that part in i know the amplifier i put on today is off an 86 i already had it .
i know things are bad right out of the box but not often, i wonder if the used amplifier is bad, its doing just like it did befor it quit firing before, that is the main reason i cut it of and unhooked the battery, the problem with that is the new amlifier is about 190 bucks, just spent 300.:mad:
oh and the tach in the factory wiring would go to the amplifier.

[Gamer]

oh and i know it is easy to burn up a msd 6al box i got 2 of them in my 79 before i went to an internal regulated altenator, keep in mind this is also a brand new msd box and like i said above i have seen things bad right out of the box.

[CWD]

I used to use use the old mechanical tachs. You could see the fluctation in the timing with a chain that had skipped. The back fire is usually the first indicator. It will only get worse. If bad enough you can bend a valve too. Just trying to help.:tup:

[SM69Mach]

Surely sounds like an electrical problem. Check your grounds and leads. The TACH usually jumps like that with there is either a bad signal or a failure in something in the system somwhere. You can check the motor mechanically with a leak down to see what might be going on and pulling the Valve covers. But from what you said, I would go really start check all of the electrical parts. Oh and BTW, I have seen it all from MSD, including parts that dont work out of the box...

Good Luck

[rodcobra]

Also about MSD ,I have done this before ,you can send the box back and they will fix it cheap ,so don't throw it away . I sent two boxes back about 2 years ago and they fixed them and sent them back for about 80$ bucks . Just a litlle info you guys like me that don't have a ton of money to buy new boxes :D

[Gamer]

I used to use use the old mechanical tachs. You could see the fluctation in the timing with a chain that had skipped. The back fire is usually the first indicator. It will only get worse. If bad enough you can bend a valve too. Just trying to help.:tup:
it only backfired small burp types, and it has not done it with all the new parts on it just skiping.

[Gamer]

Surely sounds like an electrical problem. Check your grounds and leads. The TACH usually jumps like that with there is either a bad signal or a failure in something in the system somwhere. You can check the motor mechanically with a leak down to see what might be going on and pulling the Valve covers. But from what you said, I would go really start check all of the electrical parts. Oh and BTW, I have seen it all from MSD, including parts that dont work out of the box...

Good Luck
Thanks i think i will and the first thing is the 1986-23 year old amplifier, at this point $190.00 is the cheepest thing to try.
again thanks.

[Gamer]

Also about MSD ,I have done this before ,you can send the box back and they will fix it cheap ,so don't throw it away . I sent two boxes back about 2 years ago and they fixed them and sent them back for about 80$ bucks . Just a litlle info you guys like me that don't have a ton of money to buy new boxes :D
as far as throwing it away dont worry if it turns out to be the msd box i bought it on 6/3/09 and i have the receipt. i also have a brand new still in the box never been opened msd 6420 6al right here beside me, i am thinking right now it may just be that old amplifier i used, but it is going to hurt my pocket if that dont fix my problem.
Thanks and if you remeber i work for your fathernlaw at J & D as ther stock manager or what ever my title is i run the stock room, so i do not have a lot of money, i spent it all on car parts, lets see in a year i spent 13,000.00 on my 79, 5000.00 on my S10 plus a 5000.00 trailer, and since 2005 i have spent about 12,000.00 on the 83 we are talking about now, so you see i dont have any money any more LOL i spent it on my rides, oh forgot to mention the new 08 CBR 1000 RR i got on 8/20/08.
again thanks to every one for you helpfull posts. gives me something to start with.

[UGOTTBIT]

I would just go back with the stock amplifier for the reason the if the MSD box is working the MSD is what is putting the extra spark in to the coil and creating the hotter spark and fire.

Rusty

[Gamer]

I would just go back with the stock amplifier for the reason the if the MSD box is working the MSD is what is putting the extra spark in to the coil and creating the hotter spark and fire.

Rusty
my only problem with that is i do not know what year the amplifier or distributor is, the car is an 83 w/ a 86 front clip and the interior is from a 93 thyear of the motor being it is a crate motor gives me some set backs. with the amplifier on it that came with the car quit, after putting on the one of my 86 it would then fire, i think i would be money ahead to buy a complete new distributor that will fit my aplication.
when the car is running there is no knocking or banging or even rattles. just sound like its missing on a few cylinders.
i am going to start pricing some things and then i am going to go look at some wiring and grounds this morning, yea i know on fathers day.

So Happy fathers day to all the fathers out there,
and if any one thinks of any thing please let me know. or if some one is willing to look at it with me or for me let me know i do not expect it done for free. Thanks to all replies.

[Gamer]

Thanks for all of every ones help and advice, this gives me s lot to check.

[Diver012]

May be a stoopid thing to post as I am not a mechanic, but here goes anyway..

In your original post you stated that you drove your car and put gas in it, then on the way back it started backfiring ect...

Could it be possible this is a simple case of bad gas from the gas station?

[kevinpro50]

water in gas
or map sensor

distubbter bad